The Stonehenge Test
Do you have a comment about this page?
posted by Vicky Jo at 3:00 AM
Thursday, June 15, 2006
About Me
- Name: Vicky Jo
- Location: Los Angeles, California, United States
I coach people to identify and develop their natural personality strengths in order to maximize their potential.
Please contact me to arrange a free strategy session -- I would be delighted to speak with you.
Previous Posts
- Questioning & Wondering
- Don't Worry Be Happy
- Tertiary Talk
- Psychic?
- Two Kinds of Bosses and Jerks
- The Time Machine
- Cognitive Dynamics
- The Self-Disclosure Facet
- A Simple Truth
- Fe Organizing Principles
18 Comments:
Bill:
I notice you invoke the term "boring" several times in these comments. And I find that interesting.
It has been my experience that type becomes a lens through which we define what's "boring."
I noticed during my coach training that certain conversations are almost guaranteed to put me to sleep, while other are reliably riveting.
Some of the conversations I found riveting bored the heck out of the person assigned the Observer role. For instance, once I was coaching another INFJ, and we did this whole symbolic thing about putting some value of hers in a box and floating it down a gentle stream and saying goodbye. It was kind of a ritual we went through, and we both found it very moving. Afterwards, the ENFP Observer said she found the whole event utterly boring and couldn't understand what we were up to. She was astonished to hear the INFJ "client" say how that was a very meaningful experience for her.
When I was in Memphis recently for a great workshop with John Beebe, we went through all the archetypes combined with the 8 processes. When we began doing Ni, Dr. Beebe stifled a huge yawn. Somebody spoke up about his reaction, and we all laughed. Dr. Beebe acknowledged his yawn, and noted how it might have been a manifestation of his own One-Dimensional Opposing Personality showing resistance to the very discussion of Ni.
I got a lot out of that. Sometimes our Shadow is showing up when we feel "bored."
So I think the important take-away here is to eliminate the fuzzy term "bored" from our vocabularies, and make the effort to zoom in and look at just what it is that "bores" you. What is it that cannot hold your attention?
Then map that to the type model and see whether you discover anything.
My bet is that you will. And my bet is that what "bores" you will not be interchangeable with what "bores" me. Aha! A type difference?
Perceiving functions are "irrational," meaning these processes are more difficult to control. However, all of us can and do use all eight functions.
In the Stonehenge example, I was trying to figure out how Kathy Myers and I were different in our experience of Stonehenge. And I believe Alice may have nailed it when she pointed at extraverted Sensing. Even though it is not my *preferred* perceiving process, it is very hard to turn off extraverted Sensing. For example, I hate eating in restaurants with television sets, because I cannot keep my eyes off the moving pictures. Even if it is nothing but commercials or sports or downright junk, my eyes will drift up there and hypnotically fixate on the screen. (So will my INTJ husband's.)
Now it's possible to *tune in* to each of the consciousnesses. I believe that is the point of Dario's wonderful new book. So for me, even with introverted Sensing in my demon archetype, it IS possible to "tune in" to Si.
But I'll tell you what: it's hard for me to *imagine* anything more "boring" than Si. At a family reunion one year, my mother started in on the "begats" and I thought I was gonna die! DIE!
Sometimes my husband's use of Te bores me. Some coaches get enthralled with Ne and I find myself bored. Some Ti bores me, and Fi can irritate the crap out of me. There is potential for boredom in ALL of the processes -- but what I notice is that the processes which are my *preference* are less likely to "bore" me. AHA.
So what's fun is to notice what does NOT bore you, and contrast it to what does. If exploring possibilities on the internet does NOT bore you, perhaps listening to sequential details DOES. Okay then. Now you have some power. You can make new choices. You can be gentle with yourself, and ask others to be gentle with you when something boring looms. And when you feel bored, you can detach from yourself and step aside and kind of watch yourself with curiosity. Like, "What's going on that I'm bored right now?"
When my mother did her begats, I got to detach and ask "What's happening to me?" And I realized I was resisting my mother's Si. So then I get to say, "Oh, so that's Si -- how does that show up? Where does the resistance occur in my body? Why do I think I'm dying? What's going on there? Isn't this interesting?"
So you get to turn those moments of sheer boredom into a learning experience, and discover something new about yourself.
And that's not boring. ;-D
Vicky Jo said...
Why do I think I'm dying?
I just had to share that this made me laugh out loud.
I don't know why - I think it's probably because it's the kind of dry questioning statement I would make to myself in the middle of some of my "suffering"-melodrama. <:p
And I would laugh to myself after it, too.
I think it's because sometimes the intensity (-bordering on the ridiculous) of the feeling catches me by surprise, sometimes; and then my rational mind kind of laughs- between a guffaw and 'all snickery' -about it. AHHH...a SNORT!
That's about how it would sound. :)
(I realize I am interpreting and framing your internal talk in my own mode & way- it may be nothing & nowhere like this for you, at all. Just had to share.)
But here's a question:
Between the two, which do you think- INFJ or INFP- laughs at themself more?
ENFPs.
After reading several pages on your site, I resonate more with the descriptions for the INFP (as opposed to the INFJ). I have also been cast as an INFP twice on the MBTI. The Stonehenge example, though, makes me question my preference for "P."
In general, I have a difficult time filtering out external stimuli. I live near Chicago and have difficulty at some of the 'L' stations where the trains are particularly loud or if there's a lot of traffic whizzing by.
I am, though, definitely more "center" focused, rather than outer focused (as I'm sure you can tell by my blog!), so maybe I'm an INFP that has some noise sensitivity issues.
I think it's safe to suggest that *anyone* with a preference for introversion is probably averse to noise pollution as a rule. I've noticed lately how difficult it is to find a restaurant with quiet enough ambiance to have enjoyable conversation with dinner guests!
The Stonehenge Test is not meant to be about "noise pollution" per se, but simply the ability to "tune out." Perhaps comparing it to a museum exhibit is a better comparison for what I was going after.
And I still like the example of restaurants with TVs broadcasting all around them. I don't watch TV at home, but my eyes drift right up to those screens when I'm in those places -- can't keep my eyes off them, even if the sound is OFF. :-(
Duh! LOL. You caught me there! Since extraverted Feeling is sometimes called "connecting," you may have nailed it.
I have trouble tuning people out. So, I agree with you, Vicky. However, it can get very problematic when there is just too much going on and I feel like my brain is going to short circuit, because I'm tuned in to all this sound and input. The worst part is, I can't ignore it. My mother tells me of the time when I was four, and I was at a birthday party with twenty other kids. As you can imagine, twenty four-six year olds can make a lot of noise! She tells me that after looking everywhere for me, she found me hiding under a table trying to get away from all the sound and movement.
I also can't tune out a conversation with someone...no matter how excruiatingly boring the conversation is. Yes, I'll definitely try to tune them out. But something...just...draws me...back in...I'm like a moth to a flame. I can't help but pay attention to what's around me.
But! (Of course there's a "but.") If I'm drawing, reading, writing, or thinking very deeply about something, I'm dead to the world. Which is nice, because when you surface again, it feels like you've just had a refreshing nap without ever having gone to sleep.
this whole tuning-out discussion might be about an effect of extroverted percieving processes in general- like ADHD describes both artisians and NPs. John Beebe also hints at this when he tals about the nature of his Ne (low attention span because he sees limitless possibilities). On the other hand, Se can cause a low attention span because Se Sees several different experiences to experience (that TV thing happens to me all the time too,and it really bugs me sometimes when I realize my attention is going).
I also can't tune out a conversation with someone...no matter how excruiatingly boring the conversation is. Yes, I'll definitely try to tune them out. But something...just...draws me...back in...I'm like a moth to a flame. I can't help but pay attention to what's around me.
I have online INFJ friends who have told me they experience the same frustrating thing. I an INFP, have the opposite experience. My focus goes by itself to that in the environment which is most stimulating, and tunes out the rest. This two can be problematic if the excruciatingly boring speaker is a teacher or a supervisor. Often in classroom situations, I have work against this to pay attention to lecture.
Thank you for raising this issue. I find it nearly impossible to tune things out. Even with my new spiritual practice of trying to be more present, I haven't figure out what to do about it after I become present, as it greatly impacts my work. I LOVE the content of my work, but working in a cubicle feels like a slow, painful death to me. One woman at work told me this week, "We've always been this noisy. Just get over it and tune it out!" I am now actively trying to figure out how I can become a consultant or some kind of coach. My previous job was in child care as part of a flat admin team structure (major 70's throwback) and i worked with 5 other boomer women who were infp's. Working there was the definition of chaos, and I had all the complex tasks they hated - systems maint, analysis, billing, etc. I kept complaining about needing to do something about the distraction level, and was essentially told that they were done with it, and I needed to just figure it out myself. Of course the constraints meant that i could change nothing, so I got the hint and left. I took it personally and was so incredibly offended at the time it was all I could do to contain myself when the director said this to me ("Now it's time for Cynthia to figure out what to do for Cynthia"). I got the hint though, and went packing off to school. This tuning out difference is so enlightening. They were unsympathetic because they just couldn't relate. Such a relief to know what was (and is) really going on now. I had been thinking lately that something must be wrong with me bcs i can't seem to hold a real job - not "can't" but "can't stand it", especially compared to my intp husband who is the definition of a good employee.
I had been thinking lately that something must be wrong with me bcs i can't seem to hold a real job - not "can't" but "can't stand it"...
I've said this very thing to myself, so often. I always test INFP, yet I find it impossible to tune anything in my environment out. I am so incapable of tuning out that I find it difficult to concentrate on any task if there are people around, even if they aren't speaking. I tend to isolate myself in general, as I feel as if I can only be "myself" and think clearly when there are no people present.
At work, I frequently hear multiple "requests" from coworkers at once, and set about fulfilling their needs at the same time. I put requests in quotations because many times the coworkers don't ask for my help... I just hear a need and am unable to rest until I've solved the problem.
I've looked at many of your tests, Vicky Jo, and I am INFP, no doubt about it.
My INTP father has the blessed ability to tune my mother out (ESFJ). He calls the moments when he mentally travels "building computers", and they are able to joke about it together.
I wish, more than anything, that I could do this!
I have to agree with Vicky once again - I wouldn't be able to tune people out. In fact I wouldn't want to, for people are much more important then some old stones. However a large group would eventually tire me.
I have also observed a curious fact about my ESTJ friend: when she takes pictures, she tries to get all people away from it to get it "perfect" (unless it's a portrait). I on the other hand prefer the natural view. And I am especially pleased if I manage to capture the emotions of people.
Finally an observation about sensitivity - I just can't get to sleep if there are any background noises (like television, conversations or some activity going on). An INTJ friend has no such "problem".
OMG... All this time, I thought I was just nuts. I can't even tune out commercials, at least not ones with a human voice. It's so very overstimulating sometimes.... Thank you for this entry. :)
You can't tune other people out? ..realy?... how strange, I can enter my own little world in a second.
But when it comes to restaurants, and crowded places, I usually enjoy just tuning into one conversation of someone behind me..Its like its own little soap opera. On the downside, the people I'm with don't appreciate that im totally unaware of them (If they even notice)
After doing some more research I have found an alternative explanation for this behavior by HSP (Highly Sensitive Person) theory. It suggests that about 15-20% of population (it also applies to animals) have a much higher sensitivity to sensory stimulation than the rest. To the point that they cannot shut it out. This statement is based on research of neural activity, stress hormone levels and behavioral patterns, thus seems pretty reliable. An interesting note by the author, that those people usually are overstimulated by Se and prefer using Ni as their primary process.
A quick self-assessment survey on internet forums showed that most people who identify themselves having INFJ preferences also test positive for HSP, while INFPs do not. That of course is not reliable data by any way, but some correlation may exist. Logical reasoning (HSPs outnumber INFJs by ten times) also tells me, that this attribute is spread to other types as wll and probably expresses itself differently. Thus an INFP having a heightened sensitivity to people needs is quite normal.
Um, I've written a little something about HSP on my other website. You can find the entry directly with this link:
http://www.INFJ.com/INFJ_OtherModels.htm#HSP
yes, I have read it before posting my comment earlier. I can agree that sensitivity should not be monopolized by any one type and it should not be used as an excuse for hiding. So it's probably considered best as an independent trait from MBTI type.
My personal history shows that this HSP trait is quite real though. I can still remember my teacher saying to my parents that I was the most sensitive kid she has seen in her career. And I am also quite aware of it in my physical reactions - something which gets me embarrassed sometimes.
Post a Comment
<< Home